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6 Stop Filter In Use.


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#1 geedee

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Posted 07 December 2017 - 10:18 AM

On my last visit to the small ship graveyard (posted in Landscape section ) I used the 6 stop in my last image posted there having failed the previous time I used both the 6 and 10 stop but had issues with green cast on the 6 stop and red cast with the 10 stop.... thus I wanted to have another go seems the colour cast issue was perhaps down to me merely shading the viewfinder when I should have taken time to blank it off as I did in both this pic and the much longer exposure pic posted in the Landscape section..

 

This pic was taken at sunset.

 

f11  1/10th  ISO 100   Nikkor [email protected] 24mm  6 stop ND filter  matrix metering.

 

CC as ever welcomed

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#2 Jaime Rodriguez

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Posted 07 December 2017 - 02:31 PM

I do like the scene with the Sun partially being blocked by the clouds and the reflection off the water. I'm not sure if it's my monitor but it does look a little dark. I might use the graduated filter to raise shadows and exposure.



#3 Kerry Gordon

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Posted 07 December 2017 - 04:35 PM

It seems like a nice scene but I don't understand why you've chosen to use a 6 stop ND filter.  What was it you were trying to achieve?   ND filters are not designed to deal with dynamic range issues.  You can see that the clouds near the sun have acquired strange artifacts and the image is still blown out at the brightest spot in the sky.  ND filters are designed to help the photographer amplify the experience of motion.  With ND filters you can shoot water or clouds, for example, at longer shutter speeds, accentuating movement while maintaining the right overall exposure.  (Pushed far enough, ND filters can also seem to stop motion altogether, for example by doing a long exposure on a lake with a slight breeze, the long exposure will average all the motion in a kind blurred, super-calm effect.)   But, for example, if I'm using an ND filter for one of those purposes and shooting into the sun I'll still bracket the shots and blend in post.  The ND filter alone won't solve the dynamic range issue.

You do have a green colour cast, by the way, but that can easily be removed in post. 



#4 John W

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Posted 07 December 2017 - 05:58 PM

I don't have much experience with the ND filters but I am thinking that a graduated filter may have been a better choice here. Allowing the area below the horizon a longer exposure. 



#5 geedee

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Posted 08 December 2017 - 09:45 AM

Thanks for taking the time to respond guys. Jamie I am pleased that you think there was something of interest in the pic.

 

John, you are of course correct that if I wanted detail in breakwater then in order to try to capture as best I could in camera then a strong ND grad would have helped in that respect.

 

Kerry I am ever interested in your thinking... The one time I try to be a bit artistic it seems I have broken with convention....(-:  You like the others are correct if detail in the breakwater, or if  any of the other accepted uses/effects of a ND filter that you suggested was a desire.... Though to try looking directly at the sun through a viewfinder and if one`s eyesight is not damaged from that, guessing what exposure might be required to capture a pic like the one posted....hmm?   As for the green colour cast (?)  I suspect that is down to your new desk top`s superior screen quality.... nothing showing on my old matte screen lap top...So, I can pay out a couple of grand for a desk top like yours to find out that I need to spend even more cash to upgrade from resin to glass filters...sigh! (-:   Thanks again for your input Kerry, much appreciated.

 

Yup no doubt that a new PP package and time spent trying to learn how to use it is on the cards if I want to improve at all... Yup currently considering a Mac too...........

 

Time tide and sun combined to provide another opportunity this morning so had another go... still rushing too much and got real muddy....



#6 Kerry Gordon

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Posted 08 December 2017 - 09:54 AM

Thanks for taking the time to respond guys. Jamie I am pleased that you think there was something of interest in the pic.

 

John, you are of course correct that if I wanted detail in breakwater then in order to try to capture as best I could in camera then a strong ND grad would have helped in that respect.

 

Kerry I am ever interested in your thinking... The one time I try to be a bit artistic it seems I have broken with convention....(-:  You like the others are correct if detail in the breakwater, or if  any of the other accepted uses/effects of a ND filter that you suggested was a desire.... Though to try looking directly at the sun through a viewfinder and if one`s eyesight is not damaged from that, guessing what exposure might be required to capture a pic like the one posted....hmm?   As for the green colour cast (?)  I suspect that is down to your new desk top`s superior screen quality.... nothing showing on my old matte screen lap top...So, I can pay out a couple of grand for a desk top like yours to find out that I need to spend even more cash to upgrade from resin to glass filters...sigh! (-:   Thanks again for your input Kerry, much appreciated.

 

Yup no doubt that a new PP package and time spent trying to learn how to use it is on the cards if I want to improve at all... Yup currently considering a Mac too...........

 

Time tide and sun combined to provide another opportunity this morning so had another go... still rushing too much and got real muddy....

Geedee, I'm still not clear why were you using an ND filter to start with - what were you trying to achieve and to what extent, in your view, did you succeed?  



#7 geedee

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Posted 08 December 2017 - 11:58 AM

Kerry, I would be lying if I typed that I knew what I was after when I put the filter on, I tried it out with a few different shutter speeds and liked this one best, which is a long way of saying I thought the pic was OK, nothing great for sure, but all just part of the learning process...(-:



#8 Kerry Gordon

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Posted 08 December 2017 - 09:45 PM

I'm hope you don't feel that I'm dissing your photograph because I'm not.  I was just trying to get a conversation going about how we make choices when setting up a shot.  To be honest with you I find using ND filters a royal pain in the ass and so I only want to go to the trouble when I actually need to, to achieve whatever it is I'm aiming for.  For me it has been a lot of trial and error.  I remember one time this past summer working away with my filters trying to get a shot of moving water to work when I suddenly realized -"I don't need to be using this filter now, I can get what I want without it."  And I could feel how reluctant I was to put it away.  It was like using the filter and doing the the extra work would make it a better picture.  I'm just wondering if you got caught in the same game.  Or maybe I'm totally projecting, I'm a psychotherapist, after all  :blink:



#9 geedee

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Posted 09 December 2017 - 11:12 AM

Nah Kerry, no problem here with anyone dissing my pics, though had not felt your CC as dismissive in any way.  I come here to learn and share and am grateful for any who take the time to pass comment.

I can understand that those well skilled in PP processes can achieve much of that which filters can, though there are perhaps other options worthy of consideration...? 

Some folk might prefer to spend more time in the field than sitting in front of a PC

Others might be more technically/mechanically inclined than artistic, thus prefer to use physical filtration.

The ability to see it in-camera on location as opposed to taking an image or images in such a way as to suit whatever PP processes one has in mind to apply later, with the chance that one did not get it just right in-camera and have to revisit the scene and try again, which may not be simple on occasion.

I suppose there may even be those with little interest in photography as such and would be happy to have a supply of RAW files in whatever genre, to work with on their PC in order to express their idea of art...

I suspect there is much involved trying to replicate the effects of a CP filter by use of PP that would require a lot of time and effort and still be unable to achieve the desired result in PP

 

Ultimately it is all about the end product...... though the journeys can be many and varied to arrive at that point..(-:

 

From the posted pic and the settings I suspect it would be no easy job to frame it up and select an accurate exposure at f11 in order to create such an image with such bright sunlight...  Whereas with the 6 stop filter in place it was a simple matter to point directly at the sun frame up the scene as desired and select an appropriate shutter speed taking one`s time and with no eye strain.. simple..?



#10 Kerry Gordon

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Posted 09 December 2017 - 02:13 PM

Okay, I get where you're coming from but in that case and in the case of an image like the one you've posted here I suspect you need to be shooting somewhere between 1 and 3 minutes, rather than 1/10 sec.



#11 geedee

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Posted 09 December 2017 - 04:23 PM

Thanks Kerry, though I suspect with your recommended settings the pic would have been very different with the sun and clouds blown out giving the whole of the pic a very different look...?

Fortunately as I typed above in one of my responses I took a few pics of the time with the filter in place and will hopefully post one that was a FIVE second exposure, hopefully from that you might imagine what a 1 to 3 minute exposure would have actually looked like..

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#12 TrailEx

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Posted 10 December 2017 - 10:17 PM

Based on the two pictures you've posted, it seems like a shot with a shutter speed of around 1/2 to 1 second would produce the best balance of lighted foreground and detail in the sky. The original photo seems to be going for a silhouetted foreground, which could work except that there isn't anything producing a distinctive silhouette.



#13 geedee

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Posted 11 December 2017 - 04:31 AM

Thanks for taking time to share your thinking Trailex, much appreciated.

As I typed above I did take a few pics at different settings in the hope of learning something from them, and as luck would have it I also took one at 1 second, thus you can judge for yourself as to whether it was an improvement on the first one I posted. No PP applied other than crop.

 

I have to admit that I do at times like slightly dark pics as they tend to draw me in which may be why I chose the one I did from the ones I took...

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#14 David Pavlich

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Posted 11 December 2017 - 10:17 AM

I do a lot of shooting with an ND filter, 6 and 9 stop.  I found early on that the histogram is your friend.  I always take several test shots to ensure that the light that is getting through is the proper amount for what I'm trying to achieve.  I have two reasons; first is to get that silky water or flowing clouds, or, to create motion blur.  ND filters won't help with DR unless you bracket since in the end, the same amount of photons hit the sensor, it just takes longer.

 

I like working with these filters.  Gives a lot of options.

 

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#15 Kerry Gordon

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Posted 11 December 2017 - 11:00 AM

I do a lot of shooting with an ND filter, 6 and 9 stop.  I found early on that the histogram is your friend.  I always take several test shots to ensure that the light that is getting through is the proper amount for what I'm trying to achieve.  I have two reasons; first is to get that silky water or flowing clouds, or, to create motion blur.  ND filters won't help with DR unless you bracket since in the end, the same amount of photons hit the sensor, it just takes longer.

 

I like working with these filters.  Gives a lot of options.

 

David

I agree with you David and in an all too round about way, that was the point I was trying to make.  ND filters really aren't about dealing with dynamic range.  Your point about using the histogram is also well taken.






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